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bagging coffee ?
Ringo
Top  #26 Print Post
Posted on 04/21/2015 6:44 PM
I agree with coffee and jack a valved beg is the best storage and aging. It keeps the oxigen out and let the co2 get out. Roasting is a very personal thing and you need to find what gets the flavors you like.
All you need in life is ignorance and confidence, and then success is sure. Mark Twain
 
HoldTheOnions
Top  #27 Print Post
Posted on 04/21/2015 7:56 PM
I'm wondering how vacuum sealing would affect the structure of the beans and degassing. Hmmm.
 
Koffee Kosmo
Top  #28 Print Post
Posted on 04/22/2015 1:12 AM

Quote

HoldTheOnions wrote:

I'm wondering how vacuum sealing would affect the structure of the beans and degassing. Hmmm.


Vacuum sealing coffee bags is not a complete vacuum
Many areas in between the beans will hold oxygen
Vacuum sealing should not hinder the degas process

KK
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boar_d_laze
Top  #29 Print Post
Posted on 04/22/2015 9:02 AM

Quote

Ringo wrote:
I agree with coffee and jack a valved beg is the best storage and aging....

Amen to that.

I'm going to add the non-illuminating observation that you need to use whichever method works best for you.

I pour the coffee into valve bags immediately after weighing, and heat seal the bags.

The bags we've chosen to use are expensive (as bags go) because they're not just green but "compostable." Similarly, the heat sealer is the "crimping" sort, rather than the single wire type because crimpers work better even though they're a little slower, smaller (makes them less versatile), and considerably more expensive.

Finally, I stamp every bag with a logo and write the type of bean, roast date, and weight on every bag -- along with any other information that might matter.

If we plan on storing the coffee a little past the "best window," we put the sealed bags in Coffeevacs, which seems to slow the aging process to about half.

If we want to store longer, we freeze -- a thing we don't do as often as we should -- and I allow the bags to outgas for a couple of days before putting them in a freezer bag.

In other words, we do it very much as a small commercial operation might. At this stage of the game I'm not giving away much more than twice as much coffee as we use ourselves, and the amount of trouble and expense I go to might not make sense to someone on the outside looking in.

To be honest, I find satisfaction in knowing I'm doing the best job I reasonably can, and at least as much in playing pro.

Rich
USRC 1lb Roaster, Chemex+Kone, Espro, Various FPs, Royal Siphon Vacuum, Yama Ice Drip Tower, Bunnzilla, La Cimbali M21 Casa, Ceado E92.
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Ringo
Top  #30 Print Post
Posted on 04/22/2015 9:19 AM
So what is a coffee vac?
All you need in life is ignorance and confidence, and then success is sure. Mark Twain
 
snwcmpr
Top  #31 Print Post
Posted on 04/22/2015 8:09 PM
A container with a one-way valve.
http://www.amazon...B0046JB136
I got 2, different than these or what is on SM site today, from Sweet Marias last year. I put the roasted coffee in there to rest, then transfer to a mason jar for foodsaver vacuum sealing or, as a gift, into a one-way valve bag. The bags I seal with an old vintage iron. If I do more than 2 roasts, one lb each, then I use the half gallon mason jar with a loose lid for the rest period.

Ken in NC
--------------
Backwoods Roaster
"I wish I could taste as well as I wish I could roast."

As Abraham Lincoln said "Do not trust everything you read on the internet".
 
allenb
Top  #32 Print Post
Posted on 04/22/2015 8:39 PM

Quote

JackH wrote:

I wonder if anyone has tried vacuum sealing freshly roasted coffee?

I store mine in a canister with a 1 way valve. If I am giving it away as a gift, I use bags with the 1 way valve built in.

Here is an old thread from 2006 on how to add a 1 way valve to a standard canning jar:
http://forum.home...ead_id=336


We had an Italian made chamber purge/vac machine at the roastery I used to work for and it would do a nitrogen flush then very deep vacuum to all of our coffees sold in valve bags. Most coffees were packaged no more than a couple of days out of the roaster and none of them, no matter how much of a brick they had become during the vacuum/sealing operation, ever maintained the vacuum more than a few hours due to CO2 outgassing. Afterward most of the valve bags would end up in a neutral state (neither brick nor puffed).

The question was raised whether or not a CO2 gas environment was detrimental to the flavor of coffee as it rests in a container. In all of my experience in the industry and in picking the brains of the pros in the packaging industry, I've never heard anyone make this claim. Since CO2 is a natural by-product of roasted coffee beans and they are being bathed in it continuously from day one till time of consumption, it would be a very bad thing if it were the case. Now, I have heard that if fresh roasted coffee is kept in a non-venting container and is allowed to reach the maximum possible pressure and if kept at that pressure, then it will prevent any further outgassing and can cause the time needed to degass to extend much longer than if allowed to only build to a low pressure environment. A low pressure CO2 environment in a loosely capped mason jar is a good thing and being an inert gas, helps displace freshness killing oxygen.

It would be of interest to me to know if at a certain pressure from CO2 outgassing, that the post-roast improvement from resting could be retarded or compromised by slowing down its release. I've never read anything definitive on the subject. There's obviously the difference in the quality of extraction comparing an aggressively foaming bed of coffee during brewing versus one where water can readily contact all of the grounds equally but this is not a primary reason for the improvement had during the rest period.

Regardless of how we're going to bag or store our freshly roasted coffee, the object is to get the coffee into a sealed container as soon as physically possible to minimize exposure to oxygen since the staling clock starts immediately.

Allen
1/2 lb and 1 lb drum, Siemens Sirocco fluidbed, presspot, chemex, cajun biggin brewer from the backwoods of Louisiana
 
chimpy74
Top  #33 Print Post
Posted on 04/25/2015 6:57 AM
hi guys thanks for your advice regarding bagging coffee, I have enjoyed reading your conversation.
I have noticed something today.
this probably seems obvious but I thought I would tell everyone.
I bagged up three bags of costa rica, all foil bags with one way air valves.
all were closed by squeezing zip lock with my fingers, but one was heat sealed as well.
I found after two weeks the two that were just snapped together had lost heaps of flavour and the one that was heat sealed tasted good, I think the gas must find a way out of the snap lock and leave a gap..

regards

mark
 
snwcmpr
Top  #34 Print Post
Posted on 04/25/2015 7:30 AM
I have found the same thing. If I only seal the 'zip' closure the bag does not seal, it does require heat sealing.

Ken in NC
--------------
Backwoods Roaster
"I wish I could taste as well as I wish I could roast."

As Abraham Lincoln said "Do not trust everything you read on the internet".
 
boar_d_laze
Top  #35 Print Post
Posted on 04/25/2015 7:31 AM
Coffeevac

Doug Garret (of OE) reviewed it, and if ever or ever there was a no BS guy it's Doug. He sold me. We have a bunch.

Rich
Edited by boar_d_laze on 04/25/2015 7:45 AM
USRC 1lb Roaster, Chemex+Kone, Espro, Various FPs, Royal Siphon Vacuum, Yama Ice Drip Tower, Bunnzilla, La Cimbali M21 Casa, Ceado E92.
CookFoodGood
 
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